Friday, October 17, 2008

YES for the Children

FACT:Failure to pass Proposition 8 will hurt children.

I come to you today with a post that is very near and dear to my heart. It's about the children. I have already shared many of my thoughts and ideas as to why I feel Californians should vote YES on Prop 8, but this reason surpasses them all. The children.

These faces are our future, a future I am trying to preserve through the passing of Prop 8. Please take a moment to learn why these parents are in support of Proposition 8 and the reasons they are encouraging you to vote YES for the children and the sanctity of marriage.

Meet: Daniel & Joseph
"My children are so important to me. I want to teach them correct principles in my own home. A family, consisting of both a mother and father, is the most import unit in our society and children have the right to learn this, just as I was taught and my parents were taught."
- Jessica, Dana Point, CA



Meet: TROY & COLT
"When I see my kids playing, I worry about their future and the world that they will raise their children in. I think the one thing that we can do now to help their future is to keep the family a solid unit with a mother and a father in the home. That one factor will influence the future in more ways than we know."
- Erin, Mount Pleasant, UT



Meet: TY
"God intended for marriage to be between a man and a woman, and seeing how our nation was created 'under God' I feel it would be a violation of our nation's law and God's law to do anything otherwise!"
- Meggan, Orem, UT



Meet: ABIGAIL
"A Yes on Proposition 8 will mean we will never have to worry about our children being taught values which are not values at all. A Yes on Proposition 8 means that we will never have to worry about a court forcing our church to marry a same sex couple. A Yes on Proposition 8 will remind us that we still live around many Californians who value the role of a father and mother in parenting as much as us."
- Tyler, Laguna Niguel, CA



Meet: STONE
"I think The Family: A Proclamation to the World says it best: 'Children are an heritage of the Lord" (Psalms 127:3). ...The family is ordained of God. Marriage between man and woman is essential to His eternal plan.'

"Since I have been a mother, I have an even stronger testimony that marriage between a man and woman is essential. Watching my baby grow, I realize more and more every day the differences between the role a mother has, and the role a father has, and how essential these two roles, TOGETHER, are in my child's life."
- Kendal, Lubbock, TX



Meet: Dallen
"Nothing can compare to the joy of motherhood and looking in the eyes of a little child, so new in this world. However there is another kind of joy that comes from seeing a new father look into the eyes of the baby he helped bring into this world. I feel so blessed to see my loving husband gaze, awstruck into the eyes of his newborn son, and know that this lucky child gets to enjoy the security of a home with a mother and a father, the way that God intended a home to be. Supporting Proposition 8 ensures children the opportunity to have both a mother and a father to guide them through this world in such a challenging day and time. I vote Yes for traditional marriage."
- Jacki, Tempe, AZ



Meet: Bentley & Gage
"I want to be able to decide what values my boys are taught and unless Proposition 8 passes this freedom and right will be taken from me. They are my most prized posessions and they deserve to remain as innocent and pure as they are now for as long as possible. It is my right to teach them about the world when I choose to. Please help me protect my babies by supporting this proposition."
- Jaime, Los Angeles, CA



Meet: Madelyn & Stella
"I want to live freely. I want to raise my children the way I feel, as their mother, will be best for them. I want to teach my girls good morals and high, strong values. I want to be able to worship God the way I want to. I want to preserve our democracy by letting the people decide what's best for our nation, instead of those four judges from San Francisco. I want my children to grow up in a world where "marriage" is something unique, special, and meaningful. Because that's what it is. It's important; it is, indeed, unique.

"A union "between one man and one woman" is inherently different than any other type of union. I'm voting to preserve and protect this vital institution we've called "marriage" for centuries across civilizations, and throughout the entire world. For our families, for California, for our country, and for our precious freedom which so many have sacrificed so much for, I'm voting a fervent YES on proposition 8.

"Protect marriage, protect our freedom. Vote YES on 8."
- Amanda, San Clemente, CA


Meet: LILY
The Family: A Proclamation to the World
"The family is ordained of God. Marriage between man and woman is essential to His eternal plan. Children are entitled to birth within the bonds of matrimony, and to be reared by a father and a mother who honor marital vows with complete fidelity."


Meet: Caden, Gage & Zane
- Lyndsie, Scottsdale, AZ

I hope the faces of these children and the words of their loving parents have touched your heart and given you a new perspective on why it's so important that we vote yes on Prop 8.

Vote YES for marriage. Vote YES for families. Vote YES for the Children.

36 comments:

Pomoprophet said...

As a gay person I desire to have that too. And to raise my child as a moral, productive member of society.

The only difference is I'll get the blessing of taking a child who is unwanted and unloved and giving them a stable, loving enviornment to be raised in.

How can God not honor that?

Tara and Bob said...

Great job on this post. I agree there are so many issues that are involved with this prop but one of the biggest reasons I am putting so much into it is because of the sweet precious children. Keep up the good work!

Tom said...

Lovely pictures, cute kids and heartfelt sentiments.

But I think one important point is missing: even if one accepts that it is best for children to have both a mother and a father in the home, how does denying marriage equality further that goal? If gay people can marry, it doesn't prevent straight people from marrying and having (and raising) children. Gay people aren't suddenly going to turn straight and start having kids.

I just don't see how denying one group of people their right to CIVIL marriage will affect these children. Except that maybe they will grow up in a world that is a bit more tolerant of differences between people. Call me old-fashioned, but I think that's a good thing.

Aubrey said...

Tom, thank you for your thoughts and being respectful of my feelings toward this issue. We are not trying to change anyone's mind on this issue with our posts. Or blog is for the readers who are yet undecided on this issue. For those who are looking to get the facts..

In response to your comment, I hope you will take a moment to see why I decided to post "YES for the Children"...

"Proposition 8 is simple and straightforward. It contains the same 14 words that were previously approved in 2000 by over 61% of California voters: “Only marriage between a man and a woman is valid or recognized in California.”

"Because four activist judges in San Francisco wrongly overturned the people’s vote, we need to pass this measure as a constitutional amendment to RESTORE THE DEFINITION OF MARRIAGE as a man and a woman.

"Proposition 8 is about preserving marriage; it’s not an attack on the gay lifestyle. Proposition 8 doesn’t take away any rights or benefits of gay or lesbian domestic partnerships. Under California law, “domestic partners shall have the same rights, protections, and benefits” as married spouses. (Family Code § 297.5.) There are NO exceptions. Proposition 8 WILL NOT change this.

"YES on Proposition 8 does three simple things:

"It restores the definition of marriage to what the vast majority of California voters already approved and human history has understood marriage to be.

"It overturns the outrageous decision of four activist Supreme Court judges who ignored the will of the people.

"It protects our children from being taught in public schools that “same-sex marriage” is the same as traditional marriage.

"Proposition 8 protects marriage as an essential institution of society. While death, divorce, or other circumstances may prevent the ideal, the best situation for a child is to be raised by a married mother and father.

"The narrow decision of the California Supreme Court isn’t just about “live and let live.” State law may require teachers to instruct children as young as kindergarteners about marriage. (Education Code § 51890.) If the gay marriage ruling is not overturned, TEACHERS COULD BE REQUIRED to teach young children there is no difference between gay marriage and traditional marriage.

"We should not accept a court decision that may result in public schools teaching our kids that gay marriage is okay. That is an issue for parents to discuss with their children according to their own values and beliefs. It shouldn’t be forced on us against our will.

"Some will try to tell you that Proposition 8 takes away legal rights of gay domestic partnerships. That is false. Proposition 8 DOES NOT take away any of those rights and does not interfere with gays living the lifestyle they choose.

"However, while gays have the right to their private lives, they do not have the right to redefine marriage for everyone else.

"CALIFORNIANS HAVE NEVER VOTED FOR SAME-SEX MARRIAGE. If gay activists want to legalize gay marriage, they should put it on the ballot. Instead, they have gone behind the backs of voters and convinced four activist judges in San Francisco to redefine marriage for the rest of society. That is the wrong approach.

"Voting YES on Proposition 8 RESTORES the definition of marriage that was approved by over 61% of voters. Voting YES overturns the decision of four activist judges. Voting YES protects our children."

To learn more, please visit the California Voters Guide.

Tom said...

I appreciate your passion. I have much to say on this topic, too.

But first, if you would answer my question: how would denying marriage equality increase the number of children growing up in homes with both a mother and father present?

Hizzeather said...

If I could butt in here, it's about drawing a line in the sand, Sure, some people will cross the line, but they will know that they have. If there is no line, how can we expect people to know the parameters? Children deserve to be raised by a mother & a father. If we don't make that clear, anything goes. No, Proposition 8 will not change much. It will not make divorce go away, or homosexuals go away, or women deciding to just have a baby alone go away. But all of those people need to know that they have crossed the line when it comes to the well being of a child. Sometimes it is necessary, but they should know that it is just a substitute for what is best. Being raisedd by a mother & father is BEST, and every other situation comes in second, third, etc. Prop 8 draws that line for me.

Tom said...

Hizz -

Why would this be the line? Why not work to place an initiative on the ballot banning same-sex couples from adopting? Or to prevent any doctor from providing IVF or fertility services to lesbians? Or to outlaw surrogacy when the intended parents are two men?

Any of those would MUCH more directly address your concerns.

Prop 8 doesn't help children, it puts more of them at risk, because it denies the benefits of marriage to same-sex couples who ARE raising children.

If your stated goal is more kids in mother/father homes, great. But Prop 8 does NOTHING to achieve that goal. Instead, it hurts children, it hurts same-sex couples, it hurts California.

It is unfair. It is unnecessary. It is wrong.

Christa Jeanne said...

Tom and pomoprophet -

I think the problem that we face if Prop. 8 doesn't pass is that people who share the values posted by Aubrey would be forced to act against their beliefs - like Catholic Charities having to close down in Boston, or the doctor who was forced by lawsuit to give IVF to a lesbian couple despite his religious beliefs.

That's just not right!

As for the traditional family - study after study has shown that a nuclear family unit is the most stable for children. It's not just about love - see the post I did on that ("Sometimes love just ain't enough"). It's about getting the best of the male and female role models in the home.

Again, that isn't to say that there aren't great gay parents out there (who can still adopt regardless), or that there won't still be divorce. I have gay friends who will be amazing fathers!!!

But by promoting and preserving the traditional family, we're seeking to give kids the a running start, to give parents the right to raise their children as they want, and we're trying to keep our societal structure in tact. There are far, far-reaching effects at stake!

Tom said...

Christa -

Several things.

First, Catholic Charities in Massachusetts did NOT close their doors. They simply stopped facilitating adoptions. This had NOTHING to do with same-sex marriage. They were unwilling to comply with Massachusetts' anti-discrimination laws, and they were also going to lose a large United Way contribution if they continued to discriminate. So they stopped adoptions altogether.

As far as the doctor refusing IVF to the lesbian couple, the realities of that case are more complex than most bloggers make them out to be. The doctor initially said he would not perform the IVF procedure if that was required, but that another doctor in the practice would if it came to that. But when it came to that, the other doctor also refused. This forced the woman to go to a different practice and pay higher "out of network" costs for health care.

It was determined by the court (in a 7-0 decision, so the issue was obviously pretty clear) that any doctor has the right to refuse to perform any procedure on religious grounds. But they can't refuse to treat a PATIENT on religious grounds.

"study after study has shown that a nuclear family unit is the most stable for children."

Again, how does denying marriage equality further that goal?

"But by promoting and preserving the traditional family, we're seeking to give kids the a running start, to give parents the right to raise their children as they want, and we're trying to keep our societal structure in tact."

But you are already promoting the traditional family in so many ways! Parents DO have the right to raise their children as they want. All a "Yes" vote on 8 does is deny CIVIL equality. It does NOTHING to help you achieve your goals, it will harm children being raised in same-sex households, and it will treat gay and lesbian people unfairly.

If it doesn't help you achieve your goals and harms other people, how can you be for it?

Proud Mommy said...

Being an adoptive mother as well it is still sooo important that a child has a Mother AND a Father. So many same sex couples are saying we aren't hurting by taking unwanted children. Well you are by not giving the children what they need and what they deserve a mommy and a daddy. And if this passes then WHATS NEXT!! Those who are against prop 8 say it wont affect children, it wont allow same sex marriages...well that would follow I'm sure. This is just a stepping stone. Religious adoption agencies will have to close down because the liability is too high. THAT in and of itself hurts children if agencies can't serve families by placing children with them. I just don't understand the justification of the ones who do not support this prop! Of course I am YES for preserving traditional marriage!!
PLEASE FOR THE LOVE OF YOUR CHILDREN!! VOTE YES FOR PROP 8!!!

A very proud Mommy!!

Renee said...

Tom -- I don't know if you've been misinformed, but you stated this and it's incorrect:

"Prop 8 doesn't help children, it puts more of them at risk, because it denies the benefits of marriage to same-sex couples who ARE raising children."

That's not true. If Prop. 8 passes, the same-sex couples will not be denied the same benefits that married couples have - - they already have those rights (or benefits) under the Domestic Partnership law in California. The same-sex couples do not need the title or classification of "Married" to give them those rights.

emily said...

http://www.indybay.org/newsitems/2008/10/17/18545109.php

Pomoprophet said...

PROUD MOMMY- you sound very scared to me. And you're still not addressing the issue. You say it is best for a child to have a mom and dad. I agree with that. But how is same-sex parenting harmful to children who otherwise wouldnt have ANY parents? Or who might only have ONE parent and then dont get to learn about love and committment and compromise?

RENEE- if same sex couples can already adopt and nothing will change but a "title" then how is prop 8 hurting children exactly? Because they'll grow up with a title that confuses them from what the church teaches?

The arguments are falling apart here ladies... you're contradicting each other.

Tom said...

"If Prop. 8 passes, the same-sex couples will not be denied the same benefits that married couples have - - they already have those rights (or benefits) under the Domestic Partnership law in California. The same-sex couples do not need the title or classification of "Married" to give them those rights."

Renee -

Thank you for the clarification. First, though domestic partnership is VERY close to marriage in legal terms, there are still a few differences, primarily in terms of taxation and inheritance.

But but you know as well as I there’s something profound about the relationship to which we give the name “marriage.” If it wasn't, why would people be fighting over it? (Though it seems a bit odd, fighting over a word that no one actually "owns." It's not like there are only so many marriages to go around!)

What I'm saying is there is something important about marriage. At least to me. I was married on Monday.

In addition, I am projecting a bit, thinking on a federal level. All couples need to to be able to have access to federal benefits, too. Social Security for example, or immigration status.

But thanks for paying attention!

Renee said...

Pomoprophet -- I'm just quoting you so I can reference as I write:

"RENEE- if same sex couples can already adopt and nothing will change but a "title" then how is prop 8 hurting children exactly? Because they'll grow up with a title that confuses them from what the church teaches?

The arguments are falling apart here ladies... you're contradicting each other."

Promoprophet -- I think you're assuming that my views are identical to others who posted. If I contradict them, it's because I didn't write their posts and it wasn't my point they were making (or visa versa).

I didn't say the title or status of marriage hurts the children. My view is if Prop. 8 doesn't pass, the teaching of children at school w/o parental input (because what some view as a moral issue would be legal to teach w/o parental consent) would hurt the children.

Chris -- Thanks for being so respectful in your discussion. I agree with you that the taxes, even on a federal level should be the same. I have no problem with the civil union being equal in that way.

FS Carrie said...

Actually, civil unions are NOT the same. Because of the terrible civil inequality, domestic partners have to carry around a document proving they are legally partnered to be given certain rights. When you are married, you can jump in an ambulance when your spouse is injured. You have automatic hospital visitation rights when your spouse is incapacitated. Your rights are not questioned and cross-examined, as they are in this patronizing concept of civil unions. Thank god that California at least has the laws that it does, but it's still segregating and backward.

Aubrey said...

Dear No voters. This site was not created for you. It is not a place for you to dump all your negative thoughts and banter. It is a place for uninformed voters to come and learn more about the Pro side of Prop 8 and why we, as supporters, are voting YES on this prop. Please leave your nagativity for your own sites. Thank you.

FS Carrie said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
FS Carrie said...

And yet, here we are!

emily said...

Same sex couples should seek these rights--just not through applying the term "marriage" to same-sex unions.

I think it's okay if a union between a man and a woman has separate name.

Tom said...

In all my blogging on this issue, I have never seen a Yes on 8 poster asked to leave a No on 8 blog or not to comment. It only seems to happen THIS way. It's only the Yes on 8 folks who seem to need to silence dissenting opinions.

emily said...

this article is really interesting

http://article.nationalreview.com/?q=MDFhMjk0YjI4NzgyZGM4NjMxZmY4NTQwZWNjYzkzYjg=#more

Rosanne said...

Ladies - thank you for conducting such a great forum! It really seems like you've looked at and thought about this issue a lot, and that helps me because I'm still looking at everything and trying to understand what's going on. Thank you for all your comments as well as your courage, it's very helpful!

Hizzeather said...

Tom; I don't think you read exactly what Aubrey wrote...she in no way told you to leave our blog. She simply asked you to not be so negative towards us.

I understand your passion for this issue very well, as I have equal passion...just not for the same side. I would think I was being very rude if I went to a NO on 8 blog and foolishly thought that I could convince them they were wrong. Obviously if someone has set up a blog and took so much time to post as we do, we have thought long and hard about the issue and have made our decisions.
Your comments will not change that. Aubrey took a long time writing this post, even getting pictures of children who are very special to her. I would think she would be upset for that to be attacked. I myself don't take it as personally...your arguments only make me feel stronger that I am on the right side.

The people who have commented about no on 8 on this blog, you are very welcome to your opinion, but very arrogant about it (I know the signs, as I see them in myself quite often! ;). You can see why this would offend some of us.

By all means, keep commenting on this blog. Just know that it may be a waste of your time trying to convince people who are just as decided as you are.

I can't wait for November 5th when we can all get back to blogging about puppies and rainbows and shiny things. :) ha ha! This is very stressful, and both sides are feeling the strain. Whatever the WILL OF THE PEOPLE decide on November 4th, I will abide by that.

FS Carrie said...

I'm trying to find the negativity in this post:

As a gay person I desire to have that too. And to raise my child as a moral, productive member of society.

The only difference is I'll get the blessing of taking a child who is unwanted and unloved and giving them a stable, loving enviornment to be raised in.

How can God not honor that?


I think we are all here because we would HOPE these issues are up for discussion. If it isn't, why post about it?

Tammy said...

i agree 100%. thanks for such a touching post.

McMullin Family said...

Aubrey! Love this post! You are awesome! I wanted to add as a mother how strongly I feel that prop 8 and prop 102(AZ) needs to pass. I do not want my children learning in school what is contradictory of the moral beliefs that my husband and I will teach in our home in kindergarten! If prop 8 and prop 102(AZ) does not pass it will leave the constitutional meaning of marriage open ended. Marriage is sacred and was meant to be an eternal bond between a man and a woman. Children are meant to be born in the bonds of marriage to a mother and father who love and respect one another. Our vote will certainly be be YES!

McMullin Family said...

Aubrey!!Love the post! I want to comment as a mother how important that prop 8 and Prop 102(AZ) passes. I do not want my children learning in school what is contradictory to what my husband and I will teach in our homes in kindergarten! If these props do not pass it will leave the meaning of Marriage open. Marriage is sacred and It is an eternal bond meant for a man and a woman. Children are meant to be born withing the bonds of marriage to a mother and father who love and respect one another and who will instill those values to their children.

McMullin Family said...

Aubrey!!Love the post! I want to comment as a mother how important that prop 8 and Prop 102(AZ) passes. I do not want my children learning in school what is contradictory to what my husband and I will teach in our homes in kindergarten! If these props do not pass it will leave the meaning of Marriage open. Marriage is sacred and It is an eternal bond meant for a man and a woman. Children are meant to be born withing the bonds of marriage to a mother and father who love and respect one another and who will instill those values to their children.

Hizzeather said...

fs carrie, I agree that there was no negativity in that post, but how about this one from the same person?

pomoprophet said, on another post-

oh dear...

poor Karly is so scared she doesn't know what to do but feel like a victim that some great evil in society is going to ruin her lovely little life.

I've never understood what Christians are so afraid of. Or is she Mormon? What are Mormons and Christians scared of?

Churches being FORCED to perform same-sex marriage! That is such a crock. We have a little something called the 1st amendment.

"Any child [that] does not accept all marriages are same would be construed as breaking the law" Ha! This is so beyond reality that I can't help but laugh.

And you wonder why gay people hate organized religion. Because you pretend to be nice and even have "gay neighbors" but then you write outright lies to local papers and instead of trying to reach gay people with love you try to outlaw it so you feel safe.

How horrible.


That's very condescending, and although the comment was not directed at me, it was to a very close friend of ours, so it is offensive. We just want you to respect our views, as we respect yours. Respect does not mean condoning actions, and just as you don't condone ours, we don't condone yours. That does not mean that we can't all get along!

We may pretend to be above it, but when the NO on Prop 8 people attack us personally, it hurts.

emily said...

i don't really think tom and pomo and chino blanco are really interested in an honest, sincere discussion. they are very good with argumentative posts. they post similar things on lots of prop 8 discussion blogs (as someone who blog surfs all the time). they are interested in destructive debate for their own agenda and recognition.

i really appreciate what you ladies are doing. don't back down. thank you for being brave.

and for pomo's first question about God not honoring his good desire to be a dad: you need to take that up with God himself.

The only answers anyone can give pomo is what God has told his prophets: unfortunately there is no model for same gender marriage.

Regardless of religion. I still think it's okay for a union between a man and a woman to have a seperate name. It's okay for society to encourage this relationship because it's the best for children, and the most stable (and yes we need to work on the divorce rate).

If pomo adopts, honestly, that is up to him. I applaud his desire to help children.

FS Carrie said...

I understand feeling defensive. As a person who cares about glbt rights, I feel personally attacked by this proposition. It attempts to take away rights from two of my closest friends, who just got married the day the Supreme Court overturned the ban. It's VERY personal to me, and feels like nothing less than an attack. That's how I feel when I see these posts about "preserving" the family and "saving" it from same-sex marriage: attacked. So I would imagine that for a gay person reading this site, they don't feel they're bringing any negativity in-- just responding to it. But I can surely agree not to keep things civil, as I hope I have so far. But even though this site isn't for us, we're here, because we care about the issue.

FS Carrie said...

er excuse me, agree to keep things civil.

Tom said...

"i don't really think tom and pomo and chino blanco are really interested in an honest, sincere discussion."

That's exactly what we are interested in. Problem is, they are hard to find.

Christa Jeanne said...

Yes, Carrie, you have. And I appreciate it. :)

We approach the issue from vastly different perspectives, but despite our opposing stances, I can appreciate and respect your passion on the issue - even if we agree to disagree. I really appreciate your civility in discussing this and wish more No posters could do the same.

FS Carrie said...

thanks, Christa. =)